Comments on: Doc Searls Hates Marketing?!

By: nettie hartsock

nettie hartsock — Sat, 29 Jul 2006 02:31:10 +0000

Insightful post. I actually am a fan of the “Cluetrain Manifesto” and was lucky enough to do an interview with another of its original authors, David Weinberger – http://www.ibizinterviews.com/davidw1.htm , and ten years later I’ve got to say many of the ideas he talked about in this interview still hold true.
I particularly like what he said about CEOs and conversations with customers.
Excerpt: NH: What is the role of a CEO or CIO in a hyperlinked organization?
DW: To help the company be smart. Companies are smart not because they have lots of data or lots of smart individuals but because they have smart conversations happening all over the place, crossing all the organizational boundaries, including with customers.”
And I agree we always need to see less fluffiness and hype!

By: Monica Powers

Monica Powers — Wed, 26 Jul 2006 12:27:55 +0000

Marketing won’t die but companies’ perception of the uses and value of marketing will have to evolve. Marketing must come into play earlier in the strategic process (early stage product development, business development, strategic planning, acquisitions) to keep a company and its products competitive and relevant to the intended audiences. As consumers gain more power of choice, we should see less fluffiness and hype from great companies, and more substance and forethought.

By: TheBizofKnowledge

TheBizofKnowledge — Wed, 26 Jul 2006 08:21:48 +0000

I suspect that John Dodds was right in his comment: it sure sounds as though Doc Searls is railing against promotion rather than marketing. It’s meen a long, long time since I took Marketing 101 but I do remember the differences between marketing activities and promotional activities.

By: Mario Sundar

Mario Sundar — Wed, 26 Jul 2006 02:56:22 +0000

Allen,
I hear Doc’s point-of-view since I come from a programming background myself.
There is no questioning Doc’s expertise, but a few of his arguments against marketing seem specious and overly critical.
I also have to add that I am a big fan of the “Cluetrain Manifesto” and see it changing the way Marketing/PR will operate in the future.
Mario

By: Mario Sundar

Mario Sundar — Wed, 26 Jul 2006 02:50:34 +0000

Thanks to fellow bloggers, Mack and David, for the warm welcome and encouragement.
I’m glad that most of the user comments regarding Doc’s argument, seem to agree on one issue, that marketing/evangelizing belongs to the entire company, spearheaded by the marketing team.
I’m glad that this post resonated with all the readers and look forward to raising key marketing issues in my future posts.
Mario

By: John Dodds

John Dodds — Tue, 25 Jul 2006 17:43:55 +0000

Doc Searls is just plain wrong because he equates promotion with marketing (as do many marketing departments and CEOs). Marketing is everything that creates the means of meeting a customer need (starting right back at product development). http://makemarketinghistory.blogspot.com/2006/04/sales-and-marketing.html

By: Claire Ratushny

Claire Ratushny — Tue, 25 Jul 2006 15:33:09 +0000

Thanks for a thought-provoking post, Mario. I enjoyed reading it. You make some strong points and so does Lewis Green. I agree strongly that the onus for implementation of a marketing strategy should be company wide. I also believe it should be endorsed at the highest levels since the CEO or president of a company sets the tone for the entire enterprise. Either upper management makes marketing a focus and that permeates the entire company structure, or they don’t, creating a blase culture that doesn’t care about marketing. In the latter scenario, it’s the norm to hold the CMO or marketing manager culpable for the perceived failures of marketing. Unfortunately.

By: David Armano

David Armano — Tue, 25 Jul 2006 15:22:10 +0000

Mario. Welcome to the DF!
And great first post.
Advermarketing as I like to call it will not die, but as you say here, needs to be re-wired and definitely requires some evolution.
But the good news is that we see change happening around us. And when marketers try to “pull a fast one” like the lame Wal Mart “social network” site–they are held accountable.
From my perspective, it’s a shift from communication to experiences. From canned to live. From staged to real. From exclusive to inclusive. etc. etc.
Great times to be a “marketer” eh?

By: Mack Collier

Mack Collier — Tue, 25 Jul 2006 14:33:07 +0000

Doc’s idea of a ‘perfect market’ is one where marketing doesn’t exist. Doc’s a smart guy, but he lets his hatred of marketing cloud his judgment whenever he speaks on the subject. As a result, he is constantly coming up with his latest ‘theory’ on how at some future point, marketing, and people that make money off marketing, will go away.
Of course neither will happen, because people don’t WANT to see marketing go away. Do we all want more efficient marketing, and less marketing that gets in our way? Absolutely times two. But what Doc and other members of the ‘a world without marketing is the world for me’ crowd forgets is that people WANT to be sold to. They want to be ‘romanced’ by companies seeking their business, they want to comparision shop, and many of us actually ENJOY shopping, at least for certain items.
Again, Doc’s a smart guy, but whenever he speaks on marketing, I take whatever he says with a grain of salt.

By: Allen Weiss

Allen Weiss — Tue, 25 Jul 2006 14:22:07 +0000

Personally, I like Doc Searls (he was one of the first people to give a glowing testimonial for the MarketingProfs web site), but many of the marketing ideas that technology oriented people speak about are typically based on a misunderstanding of marketing (most come from environments where R&D develops useless products and then rely on marketing to try to sell them). It seems a lot of people like to use marketing as a whipping post in order to push their so-called “new ideas” or sell books.